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This is outrageous!

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franticFurball

Senior Member

02-04-2015

Quote:
Humpelstilzche:
Exactly. And since what is ok and what is not is decided democratically here, "most people" (aka the democratic majority) decided it's not ok to critisize people constantly.

You noticed it yourself: Most people don't want to be critisized. So don't do it. You are not doing them a favor, you are offending them. It is not your decision what is offensive to others, it's theirs.


You say its everyone's definition what is offending. Fine. I decide that "gj" means "garbage jungler", which is meant as an insult. I will report people who congratulate me on good ganks from now on.

Do you see why your opinion is wrong, or do you want me to draw a nice infographic? ^^


What is wrong with your statement is the word "democratic". No, its not a democratic decision. Its a case by case decision made by every individual. In a democracy, the opinion of the MAJORITY is the legit one. I am pretty sure that the majority of LoLs community would not agree with criticism being a bad thing, or my above idea being mentally sane.

But the opinion of the majority matters less than squat with this games insane report system...its me who presses the button, and to hell with every mentally sane persons opinion.

So where is the democracy here? I see only Anarchy.


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Cobaltmotari

Senior Member

02-04-2015

Quote:
franticFurball:
You say its everyone's definition what is offending. Fine. I decide that "gj" means "garbage jungler", which is meant as an insult. I will report people who congratulate me on good ganks from now on.


Well, that's your own problem. Because everyone else understands it as "good job". Statements are not about what the person saying it thinks they mean - it's about what the receiving party thinks they mean. This flimsy argument has been seen before on this forum, and it's no more reasonable here than it was then. (And by a strange coincidence, the person making it last time also twisted the meaning of "gj" as well). With that in mind, if you genuinely intend to go about that whole belief, well...good luck having high report value ever again!

Quote:
franticFurball:
What is wrong with your statement is the word "democratic". No, its not a democratic decision. Its a case by case decision made by every individual. In a democracy, the opinion of the MAJORITY is the legit one.


And the ideas that aren't of the majority's opinion (like, say, arbitrarily deciding that "gj" means "garbage jungler&quot get ignored in favour of what the majority sees as insults or otherwise. Also, you might like this particular subdefinition from the Oxford English Dictionary:

Control of an organization or group by the majority of its members

A whole lot of "every individual"s makes up a majority. So either you're wording your arguments as badly as I presumed you would, or your statement is nothing more than a load of hot air that sounds like something smart is being said until you actually stop to look at it.

Quote:
franticFurball:
I am pretty sure that the majority of LoLs community would not agree with criticism being a bad thing, or my above idea being mentally sane.


I certainly agree with the notion that criticism in and of itself shouldn't be considered punishable. But the problem lies in the fact that the criticism can sometimes be unwarranted or, in too many cases, used as a pretext to spread negativity.

Quote:
franticFurball:
But the opinion of the majority matters less than squat with this games insane report system...its me who presses the button, and to hell with every mentally sane persons opinion.


Yeah, yeah, whatever. You aren't able to see the exact consequences of the report system, ergo you deem the report system bad and subscribe to "baseless conspiracy theory of the month". Heard it all before...

Quote:
franticFurball:
So where is the democracy here? I see only Anarchy.


Back to the dictionary...

A state of disorder due to absence or non-recognition of authority or other controlling systems

If there is indeed disorder amongst this community (and all I've seen are people complaining about their punishments while flaunting alleged innocence), it wouldn't be because of a lack of authority figures - we already have a system regulating things that is on occasion checked for accuracy by Riot staff, and this game is developed and operated on the whole by a team of actual people. So going by what anarchy actually is, you're obviously seeing things wrong. The disorder isn't because of a lack of a perceived authority - it's because people don't want to be punished, and understandably don't want to be left in the dark as to why they got punished. And I agree with that desire for explanations.


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Hagglinz BS

Junior Member

02-04-2015

Quote:
Cobaltmotari:
I certainly agree with the notion that criticism in and of itself shouldn't be considered punishable. But the problem lies in the fact that the criticism can sometimes be unwarranted or, in too many cases, used as a pretext to spread negativity.


If there is indeed disorder amongst this community (and all I've seen are people complaining about their punishments while flaunting alleged innocence), it wouldn't be because of a lack of authority figures - we already have a system regulating things that is on occasion checked for accuracy by Riot staff, and this game is developed and operated on the whole by a team of actual people. So going by what anarchy actually is, you're obviously seeing things wrong. The disorder isn't because of a lack of a perceived authority - it's because people don't want to be punished, and understandably don't want to be left in the dark as to why they got punished. And I agree with that desire for explanations.


So then the problem with critizism isn't the critizism in itself, it's the people who take it the wrong way? Ofc it is. Thats the whole point of my post. And due to these situation we get a bunch of reports from people "Who took it the wrong way" and there we go. Im guessing the Tribunal doesnt go through every game to check the credibility of the reporter to see if he is in fact right.

And im gonna say this AGAIN! RIOT themselves encourage us to "Communicate with teamates" because that leads to a higher percentage of wins!


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Hagglinz BS

Junior Member

02-04-2015

And just to bring up another thing, i see around the board that people get chat restriction for chat violation. That seems fair enough.

What i dont get is why i have been given a 35 ranked solo-que games ban for the same violation i have been accused with.

And while i strongly feel there is major flaws in the system that does these correctional decitions, as i am stuck with a chat-violation or whatever you call it, i have ALSO gotten this game ban.

Please explain this to me someone who is in a position to explain it!


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ZiMenc

Junior Member

02-04-2015

Yo RITO! At least praise people for good behavior: "Friendly" "Teamwork", Helpful, Honorable opponent. Decrease their ranked ban duration. Even in prison of almost every country, they give less term of imprisonment to prisoners who demonstrate good behavior. It's a well-known fact and you RITO are worse then prison. Jeez.. I'm speechless


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franticFurball

Senior Member

02-04-2015

Quote:
Cobaltmotari:
Well, that's your own problem. Because everyone else understands it as "good job". Statements are not about what the person saying it thinks they mean - it's about what the receiving party thinks they mean. This flimsy argument has been seen before on this forum, and it's no more reasonable here than it was then. (And by a strange coincidence, the person making it last time also twisted the meaning of "gj" as well). With that in mind, if you genuinely intend to go about that whole belief, well...good luck having high report value ever again!



And the ideas that aren't of the majority's opinion (like, say, arbitrarily deciding that "gj" means "garbage jungler&quot get ignored in favour of what the majority sees as insults or otherwise. Also, you might like this particular subdefinition from the Oxford English Dictionary:

Control of an organization or group by the majority of its members

A whole lot of "every individual"s makes up a majority. So either you're wording your arguments as badly as I presumed you would, or your statement is nothing more than a load of hot air that sounds like something smart is being said until you actually stop to look at it.



I certainly agree with the notion that criticism in and of itself shouldn't be considered punishable. But the problem lies in the fact that the criticism can sometimes be unwarranted or, in too many cases, used as a pretext to spread negativity.



Yeah, yeah, whatever. You aren't able to see the exact consequences of the report system, ergo you deem the report system bad and subscribe to "baseless conspiracy theory of the month". Heard it all before...



Back to the dictionary...

A state of disorder due to absence or non-recognition of authority or other controlling systems

If there is indeed disorder amongst this community (and all I've seen are people complaining about their punishments while flaunting alleged innocence), it wouldn't be because of a lack of authority figures - we already have a system regulating things that is on occasion checked for accuracy by Riot staff, and this game is developed and operated on the whole by a team of actual people. So going by what anarchy actually is, you're obviously seeing things wrong. The disorder isn't because of a lack of a perceived authority - it's because people don't want to be punished, and understandably don't want to be left in the dark as to why they got punished. And I agree with that desire for explanations.



fanboy detected you didnt even get the meaning of the first paragraph not taking such a person seriously



I am wondering: what do you get from sucking up to rito like that?


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Shiwah

Senior Member

02-04-2015

Quote:
Hagglinz BS:
What i dont get is why i have been given a 35 ranked solo-que games ban for the same violation i have been accused with.

Ranked restriction is a more severe punishment for people who behave particularly badly in chat; misbehaviour doesn't need to be limited to a particular mode to warrant this punishment.


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Hagglinz BS

Junior Member

02-04-2015

Quote:
Shiwah:
Ranked restriction is a more severe punishment for people who behave particularly badly in chat; misbehaviour doesn't need to be limited to a particular mode to warrant this punishment.


ANd who is to judge who behave "particularly" bad and those who just behave bad? OR those who are here due to a fking misscalculation!?


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GangrelCat

Senior Member

02-05-2015

Quote:
Hagglinz BS:
ANd who is to judge who behave "particularly" bad and those who just behave bad? OR those who are here due to a fking misscalculation!?


What is punishable and how 'bad' it is based upon data from the old Tribunal and report habits per server. So the Judge is us, the community.

Riot is the 'Judge' of the miscalculations.

-----------------------------------------------------
You must not lose faith in humanity. Humanity is an ocean; if a few drops of the ocean are dirty, the ocean does not become dirty.
Mahatma Gandhi

Je suis Charlie


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Hagglinz BS

Junior Member

02-05-2015

Quote:
GangrelCat:
What is punishable and how 'bad' it is based upon data from the old Tribunal and report habits per server. So the Judge is us, the community.

Riot is the 'Judge' of the miscalculations.



Riot is the judge Yes. And i am calling Riot out on being in the wrong on how people should be concidered "Bad" because they only base their knowledge on the reports comming from players who report who might be right or wrong!

If we where to start a campaign where a large number of people agreed on reporting players for verbal harrasment even thou they didn't, after some time these reports would add up to eachother and innocent people would be getting bans.

What is happening around LOL these days you could call somewhat a campaign, but this one is not knowingly.
People are reporting eachother for no reason what so ever, or the reason might be as simple as "I lost the game, therfor i will just report someone who spoke" in anger ofcourse, but still these things add up!

And what you are left with is a large number of people who are banned or are inn some sort of restriction that they dont deserv to be inn!

This is the problem, MY PROBLEM!


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