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I'm terribly dissatisifed with my ticket responses about me getting ranked banned.

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Humpelstilzche

Senior Emissary

02-02-2015

Quote:
ou cannot CHANGE people. People are like they are and if they ever change, they have to do it all by themselves.

Thats the genetic or cognitive way of seeing it.
Both theories do not really show the full picture. The most realistic model (currently) is the social cognitive theory, which includes social interaction. Other people DO influence your behavior. It's not true that every learning process is purely cognitive, it's an interaction of person, environment and behavior. You could read about Bandura, if you want to learn about the very basics of this theory.

Fact is: Today we know that people CAN change and other people and the environment you put the person in have massive influence on how this person behaves.
Quote:
Not motivation, not the desire to overcome an addiction, not having a certain emotional response to someone, nothing of all of this is external.

I dont know if you are aware of it, but you are refering to Rousseaus endogenetic theory of nativism here. This theory is roughly 300 years old and a little bit outdated.
Quote:
There are whole libraries of books written about this.

Although this is true, these 300-year-old books are sadly quite outdated and only have historical relevance today.

Motivation, desire, cognitition... these are still important of course. But they are in constant reciprocal interaction with the environment and other people. And you are able to influence those.


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decembra

Member

02-02-2015

Quote:
Lady Lothiriel:
I dare say it's an effort in futility and most people above a certain age do eventually realize that.

Some reach that level of emotional maturity sooner, others later and some not at all.

You cannot CHANGE people. People are like they are and if they ever change, they have to do it all by themselves. It is nothing anyone can achieve from the outside. Not motivation, not the desire to overcome an addiction, not having a certain emotional response to someone, nothing of all of this is external. There are whole libraries of books written about this.

So you (not you personally, but people who advocate flaming as part of human nature) yelling at complete strangers in something as inconsequential as an online game to try to somehow CHANGE them and how they are approaching this game exhibit only two very lamentable traits:
- a lack of emotional maturity (see above)
- certain shortcomings in your upbringing that led to such deplorable manners.


You've contradicted yourself a bit here. I've stated that my intentions were to instigate a change in others that positively affects their skill level in League of Legends. Shiwah is the one who is trying to change my attitude, my view of life etc, so that he/she and others like him/her (you, Riot), have a better experience playing the game. I don't know if you realized it while typing it, but you've just put a huge dent in any arguments against me.

"Fact is: Today we know that people CAN change and other people and the environment you put the person in have massive influence on how this person behaves." - Humpelstilzche

I do agree with this, obviously. From my personal experience playing in Normal Draft last night with others who clearly have ranked restrictions, I am of the opinion that Riot is putting us ranked restricted players in the wrong environment to influence the change they desire.

I played a game with Diamonds who's approach to teamfights was to send the marksman and support in first to deal damage so they could walk in after we die, clean up, and finish the game with an awesome KDA ratio. They ignored the chat altogether, and every single plea I made for them to engage the enemy the same time I did, until I made a baron call which secured us an uncontested baron. They responded quickly to that, likely only because it gave them the possibility of winning without me. We won, but I didn't have fun in that game. It was lonely. Our team wasn't cohesive at all. I had to farm as a support so that I could keep up with all the solo trade gold they and the enemy were getting. Who knows what this experience would feel like for someone who didn't have the insight to farm on a support? I was there for objectives, I was there for teamfights, I was warding and pinging and requesting teamwork. I would do all of this in a ranked game too, so what does Riot want me to see here?


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Shiwah

Senior Member

02-02-2015

So, I'm trying to change your view on life when recommending you to keep certain things for yourself instead of typing them in the chat, potentially ruining your own matches.

Okay. *shakes head in disbelief*


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decembra

Member

02-02-2015

Do you finally understand? Or have you not yet figured out that you've been responding to what you view as rude behavior with "just shut up, you'll be a better person"?


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Lady Lothiriel

Senior Member

02-02-2015

Quote:
I dont know if you are aware of it, but you are refering to Rousseaus endogenetic theory of nativism here. This theory is roughly 300 years old and a little bit outdated.


I am speaking purely about the cognitive process in an unchanged environment. My approach is not so much a scientific but a practical one.

I am leading people for almost 20 years now. I have sat in quite a lot of seminars about how to deal with addictions, with people on the verge of burnout and all other sorts of personal problems.

Bottom line always is: you can give them a helping hand, but the decision to take it - to change - is always theirs alone. If they don't want to be helped, nothing you can do will change the negative outcome.

This theory served me nowhere as well as it does in this game and this particular forum.


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Warbackxoxo

Senior Member

02-02-2015

Your experiences don't seem to match up the actual behaviour of a competitive game/sport, which is quite diferent in many regards.

All this rethoric of being silent means you're better, is completly off-point. YOU ARE the bigger man if you shut up or do nothing, in situations where someone's atacking you for no reason, outside of spite. But when you enter a "competitive" enviroment and underperform for whatever reason, the reasons for "flaming", for instance, don't just revolve around someone being arbitarly unplesant.


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Lady Lothiriel

Senior Member

02-03-2015

See, that is where your and my views fundamentally differ. I strongly believe that good manners and common courtesy are not circumstantial.
They apply in EVERY situation or they would not be much use at all.

You cannot in good conscience call yourself a well-brought up, well mannered person if you allow that there might be situations in which it is permissible or even necessary to throw all rules of politeness overboard and be nasty to a person who has not done you any harm.

Side note:
You are low gold (maybe back to plat), I am low silver. Nothing in all of this is competitive in any way. This is like talking about how me reaching level xx on WoW somehow entitles me to be unpleasant to someone who in my perception hinders my levelling progress.

This is a game. Period.


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Riot MetaTrace

Player Support Coordinator

02-03-2015

Hey Specky,

I know it can be frustrating not being shown the logs of games in which you have been reported. Especially after the tribunal in it's previous form, sent offending players reform report cards including this.

As the tribunal is no longer available in this capacity, player support often get requests for evidence when a player is disciplined.

To explain the reason we do not offer this service, is because it would take a small army to offer it to all players. And because we don't offer this service, players often assume we don't have any evidence or context on why they were restricted/suspended or banned.

This is of-course not true, I could smite players like the best of them! However I wouldn't dream of doing this unless I could offer it to every player that requested this of me, and alas I cannot.

I am sorry you feel let down by support but best of luck getting rid of the restrictions and in your future games .


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Warbackxoxo

Senior Member

02-03-2015

You're confusing poitns, i was adressing your claim that people who flame lack emotional maturity, i pointed out that that's not the main factor.

Your personal views about how sucefull something is as a team is irrelevant, there's no comparassion you can make that works for this game, because it's a forced scenario of 5 strangers working together for 30m. And there's isn't a formula to be sucefull to win, outside of playing good.

This is a game. Period. Social conduct is a very small part of it, specially positive one, it has no impact almost. Unless you're already spiralling down or up.


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Wolf315

Senior Member

02-03-2015

Quote:
Riot MetaTrace:
Hey Specky,

I know it can be frustrating not being shown the logs of games in which you have been reported. Especially after the tribunal in it's previous form, sent offending players reform report cards including this.

As the tribunal is no longer available in this capacity, player support often get requests for evidence when a player is disciplined.

To explain the reason we do not offer this service, is because it would take a small army to offer it to all players. And because we don't offer this service, players often assume we don't have any evidence or context on why they were restricted/suspended or banned.

This is of-course not true, I could smite players like the best of them! However I wouldn't dream of doing this unless I could offer it to every player that requested this of me, and alas I cannot.

I am sorry you feel let down by support but best of luck getting rid of the restrictions and in your future games .


Hello, since a rioter has been responding to the forums here in forever I'd be happy to take my chance on this; could you take a look at my support ticket since it got lost in the ticket queue again. I have had a problem with the chat restriction for over 2 months now since it takes forever to get a decent response in the support.

They even admitted the system made a horrible mistake in my case, yet I'm still restricted. Also nobody has been able to help me yet in my post regarding this.

It's a major letdown for both me and the rest of the community that there has been given so little attention to the player behavior support team. Me and a lot of others are really curious for the explanation.

Here (http://forums.euw.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=2048055&page=8) is a link regarding the complete chaos that is occuring on my account regarding both the bad help from the support and the error with the chat restriction, something the rioter admitted that happened on the account. He reduced/removed my chat restriction 3 times now, yet I'm still restricted. And it's already been 5 days since the last response, making this a ticket lasting for over 2 months with a mere amount of 3 responses by the behavior analyst.