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the enemy got top (windmill), what now?

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Exotic Pretzel

Member

01-10-2014

Dear dominion friends

In most of the dominion games on EUW, teams that have lost top/windmill attempt to reclaim said missile-launching platform by pushing minion waves and then assaulting 4 fierce foes that defend it with whatever means available to them.

However intuitive that strategy may be, it - more often than not - fails to do the trick. Or, as a summoner from NA puts it:

"A coordinated team isn't going to assault a turtled Windmill. It's pointless. Like you said, you've already lost the fight once, they've got gold and experience on you, plus a turret. It's basically a 4v5. You have to pull champions off that point to assault it effectively. You do that by forcing their hand to take another point. If you gank and take bottom, they need two to take bottom.

If four of you back cap their mid, they have to drop down to take it back, or ignore it and take your mid. Which let's your team circle back around and take the weaker top.

The possible scenarios are limitless, but the point stands that beating your face against Windmill is not a good way to recoup that initial loss."

See you on the fields of justice and good luck!

So long
Coffee


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Penteano

Senior Member

01-11-2014

That doesn't work on low elo Dominion (where I'm back at as I decided to try a Nida ad build and as it was bad enough I'm doing it on weekend after successfully leaving it days ago ^^). People panic too easy with any situation or they'll say "it's just Dominion, let's troll". Too bad Riot abandoned this mode and people treat it like trash.
I read the NA forums some times, their competitive Dom guilds are very good, helped me a lot.


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Stephanovich

Senior Member

01-11-2014

I hate it when I gank bot and our bot complains about me ganking -_-


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Penteano

Senior Member

01-11-2014

I complain if someone gank bot if: gank failed, because of the gank enemy got top, because of the gank the enemy will send 1 more bot and as we'd have to fight to take top again it may be enough time for them to do a successfull gank and take your point on bot.
So ganking needs to be well done if it fails your team will be punished twice.


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Exotic Pretzel

Member

01-11-2014

Just because the gank is unsuccessful doesn't mean it's bad gank... if you need another point, ganking bot is - in like 80% of the cases - a decent idea, even if it merely serves as a diversion.

Above 2k elo, people start using their brains and - in most cases - won't simply push windmill. You won't be blamed for ganking bot either, unless your team loses windmill because of it.

On EUW, however, there are no more than about 15-25 players with that kind of elo. Thus even if you reach 2k, the matchmaking system will often use you to balance 1.6-1.8k elo matches. Still, good matches happen more often once you get there.

You can check the average elo of your team on kassad.in or just count the amount of revives in the match you play... more than 7-8 revives means you're up there.


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Penteano

Senior Member

01-11-2014

lol something failed and it wasn't bad. Okay...
Ganking is a good idea but saying a failed gank isn't bad dude... the consequences of this are too hard in such a short map... oh well, I'm low elo, what do I know? ^^


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Exotic Pretzel

Member

01-11-2014

Sorry, I didn't mean to offend. A decision should be judged the moment it is made, no? not after the event... example: A man sees a child screaming in a burning house. There's an 80% chance that if he goes in, he'll be able to resuce the child. On the other hand, there's a 20% chance that both will die. Assumnig he decides to go in and fails, was it a bad decision? i would say no, because at the moment he made the decision, the only thing he knew was that the chances of success are very good.


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Penteano

Senior Member

01-11-2014

That's why I said.

Quote:
Penteano:
I complain if someone gank bot if: gank failed, because of the gank enemy got top, because of the gank the enemy will send 1 more bot and as we'd have to fight to take top again it may be enough time for them to do a successfull gank and take your point on bot.
So ganking needs to be well done if it fails your team will be punished twice.

Most times it's just better to stay with your team.


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Exotic Pretzel

Member

01-11-2014

I think I don't understand... of course it's hypothetical. My argument is that even IF the gank failed, there's no reason to complain as long as the decision to gank was the correct one.

Oh and yes, as long as you have top, ganks are not necessary. however, this thread is about the times your team does NOT have top.


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Stephanovich

Senior Member

01-16-2014

Quote:
Penteano:
I complain if someone gank bot if: gank failed, because of the gank enemy got top, because of the gank the enemy will send 1 more bot and as we'd have to fight to take top again it may be enough time for them to do a successfull gank and take your point on bot.
So ganking needs to be well done if it fails your team will be punished twice.


The enemy already has top remember? That's the point of the thread. I don't gank bot if we have top. That would just be silly.

Either way, if the enemy has top, you have to force a fight somewhere else unless they are sitting at the point with low hp and easy to kill....which should never happen anyway.

"lol something failed and it wasn't bad. Okay...
Ganking is a good idea but saying a failed gank isn't bad dude... the consequences of this are too hard in such a short map... oh well, I'm low elo, what do I know? ^^"

You still have to try something. Staying with the team top and keep trying to push waves or whatever to try and take windwill back is stupid. The chances are far too low to do it. So what happens then? The enemy keeps 3 points unless you bot get their bot in the 1v1. You don't want to rely on that to win.


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